Low connectors against a medium raise

junYUN · #1 10-31-04, 04:53 PM

that's a tough call, and i would say danny n is most definatly a better poker player than me... so i'll give him the benefit of the doubt.

eddo31 · #2 10-31-04, 05:48 PM

i think it is a smart play by danny, but only because he can get away with it. i woul dnever be able to make that play. my 75s would be in the muck preflop, but he is good enough at playing postflop that he can get away with these types of plays.

this just indicates how important deception is. it seems like danny, and most other top pros, would rather have a deceptive hand than a big hand.

2Tone · #3 10-31-04, 05:53 PM

is not right for me.

In theory, I understand Daniel's logic. But in the games I play, I can't see putting that much faith in 5/7 suited, pot odds or no. I'd like to say that I'd factor other elements into play -- the nature of the table, the size of my stack, etc. But the truth is, I'm not going to defend that hand against a decent size raise.

Good post, BTW.

omahilo · #4 10-31-04, 06:37 PM

I like connectors when I have position... if its folded to me on the button or one position off the button I will usually raise and if one of the blinds have a hand they might reraise but if its down to me and the BB, the BB might just call, trying to trap me with AA or another PP.

johnbaker · #5 10-31-04, 06:49 PM

Daniel's theory is based entirely upon implied odds. Why do you think someone would fold QQ on that flop but not AA? That makes no sense at all, the only difference between those scenarios would be if someone held KK or AA against the QQ. If you hit your flop with suited connectors like that, and you know your opponent has a high pocket pair, then your implied odds have paid off. Simply make an overbet, make it look like a steal, and the other guy WILL go all in with a high pocket pair 99% of the time (unless hes a genius or a pussy), and you will get paid off beautifully. If your opponent had AK or AQ or something, then they will only call with a flushdraw, and you can (and should) go all in on the turn if a blank hits.

-jB

2Tone · #6 10-31-04, 06:53 PM

Genius or a pussy? Pussy or a genius? And how to tell the difference? Questions worth pondering.

johnbaker · #7 10-31-04, 07:51 PM

....you tell the difference based on the hands that player has shown down and what his play style is. If the player is afraid of you (suited connector user) then they will play very defensively, probably bet their overpair for value, and fold to an all-in from you. If the player is very smart and is capable of putting you on hands preflop, he might fold to certain bets here (not afraid of a straight, but afraid of 2 pair or a set)

these descriptions are crappy but what i mean to say is, it all depends on the other player's previous track record

-jB

Defendant · #8 10-31-04, 07:08 PM

Well...thats where I disagree. Its a lot easier to fold QQ because of the possibility of KK or AA out there.

Defendant

johnbaker · #9 10-31-04, 07:59 PM

Im very curious to know what would compel you to fold QQ on an innocent little flop like that... any supertight players are going to reraise with KK or AA preflop, and in a tournament if you commit a very strong player to a pot, then they will probably push in instead of giving someone with suited connectors a chance to hit a flop. The likelihood of someone having KK or AA in this situation is very low unless you have a tell on them that says otherwise, and the only logical reason for you to fold here is if you fear a set, or if you have a very strong tell on someone that says they called preflop with suited connectors and have caught 2 pair or a straight. dont let people on straight draws bet you out here, and dont be afraid of a trap. most importantly, dont fear AA or KK on this board... protect your hand so someone with AK cant call and catch on the turn and river to break you.

-jB