What am I doing wrong?

[BrianSwa]

Well lost $100.00 at jetset over the last couple days, really dont know what im doing wrong im playing tight poker and pushing when I got the best hand but seems like someone is always sucking out on me in the end. Im playing low limit which is the only choice I have since cant afford to buy into a higher level game so I know the suckouts are to be expected. Just seems like the suckouts take my bankroll before I can get any significant gain, maybe it was a mistake to put my money in that site at all since there isnt alot of action there. Im starting to think it might be wiser to play MTT or sit and go's with a limited bankroll instead of playing the micro-limits. Any thought's on this? I really dont think im a bad player, I mean I might be but dont think I do anything different then anyone else. Maybe its just im not good online and cant make that transition from B&M to online because seems to me like a world of difference between the two. Never had this problem in the casino always seems like at casino the top pair wins more then the straight and flush, but noticed online straights and flushes are everywhere. Yes I know we want people chasing but when there chase hits and you have a limited bankroll a couple hits and your/im broke!

[fonzerelli_79]

read up some books - supersystem, lee jones low limit poker etc

start keeping track of your game with pokertracker or some other poker tracking software. It might be easier to see what your doing wrong if you start monitoring the way you play

it also sounds like your taking your whole bankroll to the table - from your post i dont know if this is the case or not. Id only take about 10-15% of the cash you have to the table at any one time.

What level are you playing at - your perhaps playing at too high a level. Ive made a few hundred bucks in the last few weeks from playing at the $0.50-$1.00 tables at party - got my bankroll over $250 from $20 i had left in an account. Im not moving up limits til my bankrolls 5 or 6 times this. Even though i seem to be consistently winning at the moment - there are still a lot of times i call when i shouldnt and fold when i should call etc - if i had taken all my cash to the table every time i would have busted out for sure.

how tight are you playing - does jetset have a stats facility, could you post your stats here - itll be easier to determine whats wrong with those stats

[BrianSwa]

usually .25/.50 which I hate by the way playing 2/4 in B&M then having to play .25/.50 online is killing me I cant stand it. Im looking at pokerstars tornies and there looking nice so might try to put some money on there, as for how tight im playing....remember in high school that girl who never dated or had a boyfriend ever....im as tight as she was usually Im a rock in first 7 positions then loosen up if its folded to me and I have position on the person but ive noticed this dosent work to well in low limits since it hardly ever gets folded to me and if for some reason it is any raise they look at and laugh and call with there 5-6. Thats why im concidering tornaments , I read a new book every couple weeks. Guess im just frustrated seeing all these crappy hands beating my premiem ones, aggravates me to know im folding these crappy hands then the next hand someone is running them and winning with them. I know im making the right decision by laying them down but still gets to you.

[ChipFish]

OK... Here is your first lesson...
Just because you are dealt Ah-Kh does not mean you have the same hand as
Player B. who was dealt Ah-Kh in the next hand.

Example
BrianSwa is dealt Ah-Kh
player 2 is dealt Ac-As
player 3 is dealt Ad-Kc
player 4 is dealt Ks-x
player 5 is dealt .... etc.

Flop is 5c-6c-7c Turn is 10-c.

Now then.
Hand #2.
Player 2 is dealt Ah-Kh
Flop is As-3h-8h Turn is Kc


Now yes, you are dealt the same holecards... but only one of these hands is a premium hand after the flop, and the other is garbage. Learn to differentiate and you can learn other things.

[omahilo]

I think personally you need to loosen up alittle bit... gotta remember that it is limit holdem and not no limit hold em. I remember before in one of your post about only playing QQ preflop for 1 bet or something along that nature (might need to refresh me on this).

Anyways premium hands such as AA KK and QQ will usually win you a small to decent pot and lose you a huge pot. You should try playing more suited connectors in mid to late positions such as 89s, 67s, etc. you can see the flop usually for 1 bet and get away from the hand if it doesnt hit rather easily.

I will give you an example of this... I was in the BB with 35 spades and someone raises it... a few callers and I call the 1 more bet to see the flop... the flop comes 245 with 2 spades, which gives me top pair,open ended straight draw, and straight flush/flush draw. I figured I had 20 outs (I think) to win the hand and these 2 guys started betting and raising each other and then the turn brought another 5, which ended up winning me the pot.

Anyways they ended up having QQ and KK but I got to see the flop for only 1 more bet and got a awesome flop. I dont know if this is the right play or not but I do know that QQ and KK lose them a huge pot.

You just have to be able to get away from the suited connector if it doesnt hit. Im a tight player but also like to mix it up with the connectors so I dont become too predictable. It sounds like you wait for AA, KK, QQ, JJ, AK, and AQ.

[BrianSwa]

must of misunderstood me was talking about them calling pre-flop raises with something like 8-2. I know after flop some premiem hands lose all value like A-K with a qq2 flop of course is as good as dead. The whole post was about cards calling raises pre-flop, im to the point where I hate raising pre-flop because it dont drive anyone out.

[BrianSwa]

thanks omahilo, I think your right about that and I thank you for your advice call me crazy but actully want to hear what Lou thinks about this and also TP.

[ChipFish]

Yes, I did miss that.

Not much you can do... except continue to raise the pot when you figure to have the best of it, sure 8-2 wins once or twice, but over the long-run........

Also, a little tip for you.... if you are continually getting 7-9 callers every hand, then perhaps it is time to start looking for the flush draws?
Start playing Ace-anything suited for 1 bet, and up to 2 bets if you get 6-9 callers. If you miss the flop, dump it. If you hit the ace, be prepared to dump it.
if you hit 2 to the flush, raise it.
if you flop the flush, check the flop, check-raise the turn or call and raise the river.

You'll miss the flop more times than not, but will get paid handsomely when it hits.
Same thing goes for connectors....

[BrianSwa]

k thanks for the tips chipfish, I really do appritiate it.

[SirFWALGMan]

It sucks. Sometimes you just have off days/week and then everything clicks. I would be careful about playing too loose. Do you have any stats on your play? Do you use Poker Tracker? If you posted some of your stats from PT we could probably do more than shoot in the dark. Also if you take a session and show some of the loses we could take a look and see if anything stands out.

How long did it take you to blow through the $100? Were you playing things besides .25/.50? cmon.. did you jump on a higher table, or try a $10 tourney just for the heck of it? Tell the truth.. heh.

Anyway.. give some more info and maybe we can help. Otherwise we can verify your playing well and things will turn around..

[Gutzz]

Yeah,

Also how many tables were you playing? 200BB is a decent roll, but if you're 4 tabling... More hands = more variance.

Personally I think you should loosen up a little. I dunno what you think tight is, but imho tight is VPIP of 16 percent or less.

I play loose limit (1/2 isn't .5/1 loose, but some tables are madeningly loose (in a good way) ), and my VPIP is around 19 at .5/1, and 17 at 1/2. So loosen up a little.

I agree with axs and kxs in loose multi pots. Although I'd only play Kxs in LP.

Also I dunno what your PFR is, but I think you might want to increase it to at least 8 percent.

Buy PT. This way you'll have a better idea (with a large sample size), what hands win money and what lose. Also you might be able to see where you're bleeding chips more easily.

Anywho, gl

[edit: Would like to add that I think you should take a few weeks off online play.. Sounds like you really don't like .25/.5, so take some time off and come back in a better mood. ]

[BrianSwa]

yes I am, not playing poker for about 3 weeks or so right now besides maybe free tornaments just for the fluck of it. Thanks again for everyones advice. Ok just downloaded the free version of pokertracker now if I can just learn to use it

[fonzerelli_79]

i dont understand this

if you can only afford to play .25/.50 online - how can you afford to play 2/4 in B&M. People sitting at 2/4 tables online take hundreds of dollars to the table so if this the case - whats the huge deal about losing $100. You said that your now playing freerolls because youve busted out.

Im sorry but this just doesnt seem to add up

i think this could be one of your main problems. Do not get attached to hands which would be considered strong pre flop if the flop totally misses you. You should be prepared to fold cowboys, bullets etc if the flop totally misses you and someone is betting heavily.

[BrianSwa]

when I go to B&M its like a family thing my wife comes too so I have the extra money because she is going and its a trip. Online is a totally different thing she isnt involved so I have to make the extra money and with her not working its hard. bugsys club has this thing where you can win bugsys points in there freerolls and for every 1,000 they give you 10 bucks might take awhile but think I can make little profit on there.

[Aequitas58]

You should get off the notion that you can make money at poker. I'm not trying to insult you, but too many people think they can easily "beat the game." To make money at poker, you need alot of things: a proper bankroll, the emotional ability to deal with beats, the mental ability to deal with variance, if playing NL, unrelenting aggression in those special situations, and most importantly...

...the instincts / poker-savvy to identify those aforementioned "special situations."

Do you meet any of those requirements?

From what I gather, you're playing on scared money (well, not anymore), you certainly can't deal with variance... and your level of NL aggression is suspect.
Losing money at poker is completely acceptable, if you consider poker a hobby, and simply chalk the losses up as entertainment expenses.

If you want to get serious about poker start back at the basics. Play limit, because it's better w/ the swings. Buy poker books and actually READ them. Over and over. Keep your books accessible, and reference various sections when you have a question. If you can't find your answer, search the internet forums.

Always keep in mind, you're not a character in Rounders, and, unless you have the luck of a Jackass, then you should be content with grinding out a few BBs/hr while partaking in a hobby you enjoy.

[BrianSwa]

thanks, I didnt take one bit of what you said as a insult and have to admit its pretty damn good advice, I really like the way you slid the insult at jackass in there, anywho Ill take your advice and start back at the beggining. Im not to concerned with making tons of money, I dont expect to get rich from this but would like to break even. You are probolly right I'am playing with scared money which I know is wrong but hey im no lawyer . Thanks again for your input Lou and everyone else.

[jimmym]

Hello.

I have found playing at low limit tbls can be the quickest way of eroding a low bank roll, the problem playing low limit tbls is that everyone playing will take risks thay would never do if the stakes were a little higher, so when you pull what in your case you would call a good hand eg-A/K 10.10 ect the likelyhood is that because of the low limits other players will bet the first couple of rounds anyway, even with 3.4 - 2.7.
Then you find they have caught a hand and you lose, this I find leads to you betting on anything or sitting playing poker for hours with no real chance of building up you funds.
I know a lot of players love low limits and enjoy them, but my advice to yo ( for what it is worth) would be to step up a couple of levels and play higher limits, even with a low bank roll you can soon build it up, it is very important to watch a few tbls first before joining, you will pick out a couple of chance players and then its time for you to join.
$100 is a fair bankroll and one you should be able to work with without playing on low limit tables, the sit n go games are another way of building your bank roll, but again I am finding that playing higher stakes leads to meeting more players who take less chances.

Jim.

[Talking Poker]

Wow.

Damn good post, Lou.

[Aequitas58]

Playing on scared money is basically playing above your head. It's playing with money that you really can't afford to lose. Try to avoid this at all costs, because, invariably, it affects how you play the cards at the table.

If this means taking time off from poker, then do so.

[BrianSwa]

ok this is gonna sound stupid, I finally bought super systems, I know you all are gonna say well its about time. Im reading it cover to cover acting like ive never played a hand of poker in my life. So far the book is amazing, wow Doyle had a rough as hell life, im very impressed at how he grinded it out in his early years.

[fonzerelli_79]

yeah its a good book. Probably no need to read it cover to cover as theres a lot of other games covered - maybe best sticking to hold em for now (thats what i did)

[BrianSwa]

I play 7 card stud alot so that section im interested in, the whole book is pretty nice, I dont seriously play razz but I'am enjoying that section also. I really like Doyle's opinion on playing connectors though.