Controversy(?) in Aruba

Quint · #1 09-29-05, 12:31 PM

Bad shuffle, bad luck, collusion, or sour grapes?

From Cardplayer Log

Date / Time: 2005-09-29 09:15:00
Title: A Bad Scramble for Breakfast?
Log: Allyn Jaffrey Shulman was the first player eliminated today amidst some controversy. On the very first hand, Shulman was dealt A-K suited and got it all in against an opponent with pocket tens, one of those tens being a heart. The flop came 8h-7h-6h. The player with the tens took a huge lead in the hand after this flop, as he still had his overpair, and now had a gutshot straight flush draw. The turn sealed Shulman's fate when it came 9h, completing here opponent's ten high straight flush. Keep in mind that this was on the first hand of the day, with a brand new deck.

GeoffM · #2 09-29-05, 12:38 PM

I'd really be pissed off here. Depends on the card shuffler they used and the method they shuffled, but I know most of those card shufflers will go 1 card from this pile, one card from that pile, one from this, one from that.

I think it's bs that the 4 hearts came up in a row like that.

Quint · #3 09-29-05, 01:14 PM

It's been many moons since I last visited Aruba, and I didn't play poker then, but the rest of the casinos were pretty low tech then compared to Vegas at the same time. I wonder if they even use the shufflemaster machines. I'm sure TP can verify.

Do the players cut the cards before each deal, or is it all in the dealers hands?

I agree, I'd be pissed.

PShabi · #4 09-29-05, 02:11 PM

No player cuts, that's for sure.

GeoffM · #5 09-29-05, 02:14 PM

Quint, a cut would not have done much in this case anyway. A cut is used moreso in home games so people can't "top" the deck. The cut may have changed the board, but the board may very well have come out in spades the same way with a cut.

Quint · #6 09-29-05, 02:53 PM

Yep, I was just thinking out loud. Didn't mean to imply that it would have changed anything in this situation. A poorly shuffled deck is poorly shuffled throughout (if that was the case in this situation). Not having played live in a casino, I was just wondering if the deck was cut after being shuffled. Seems to me it's a good idea for all of the same reasons that it's a good idea for a home game. An unscrupulous dealer could slow riffle or otherwise flash cards to an accomplice.

Talking Poker · #7 09-29-05, 10:23 PM

My guess is that this was a total fluke, and nothing more. The cards are shuffled by hand here, and shuffled well from what I have seen.

I HAVE seen a number of decks destroyed because of "marks" on the cards. Most seemed innocent enough, but one looked like a marked Ace to me. It had an obvious fingernail dent along it's top edge. Hmmmmm.... That was maybe 40 minutes into my first table on Day 1, btw.

eddo31 · #8 10-02-05, 11:24 PM

i see this as bad luck more than anything else.

the only reason that anyone is making a big deal about it is that the player that was busted was a shulman and is part of the cardplayer family. if this happened to a regular online qualifier then there would be a bunch of jokes about live poker being rigged, but nothing more would come of it.